How do I handle Mom's requests for more money?

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How do I handle Mom's requests for more money?

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Mom put me on her credit union accounts years ago when she stopped driving so that I could do her banking for her. I ask her several times a year whether she wants to change that and she always says I'm the only one she can trust (my siblings are both irresponsible with money). Her SS is direct deposited and any checks that come in from pension or investments, I deposit for her. When she entered memory care 3 years ago, she asked me to bring her $200 a week in cash, which I did because it IS her money and who am I to tell her she can't have it? I figured she wanted it for lunches and shopping with the facility. I stopped her credit cards and did not give her blank checks at the recommendation of the care facility.

My sister took her to a medical appointment and, when looking for Mom's insurance card in her purse, found almost $1000 in cash. She told me and I stopped bringing money to Mom for a couple of months, explaining that I knew she hadn't spent what she had. When she started again asking for money, I brought $100 a week. As her dementia has progressed, she has begun losing money. She declares it to be stolen from her, and it is possible that it was, but more probable that she spent or misplaced it. The problem is, she keeps asking me to bring her more. When I suggest that she keep less money to avoid it being stolen, she gets angry. I tried explaining that the facility does not want her to have large amounts of money lying around her room or in her purse. There is a footlocker in her room that she and I have the keys to and she wears the key around her neck. She locks her purse in there (when she remembers) and several "valuables," such as her candy, snacks, some prized sweaters, her camera, and some costume jewelry. I keep a debit card for her account that she uses for purchases on our weekly shopping trip. The hairdresser at the facility sends me a monthly bill, which I pay from Mom's account. I understand that she feels destitute without ANY money, but on the other hand, she is vulnerable to unscrupulous staff, dementia addled residents who toss her room regularly, and her own forgetfulness. She thinks I'm just being mean and trying to take what is hers. Not sure how to proceed.

Care Decisions Dementia Behaviors Financial Planning Memory Care

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From my family’s experience having my mother in what we considered an excellent facility, the locker for your mother is useless. No matter how good the place or the staff, there is always room for the dishonest and unscrupulous, having something locked just calls out to them. The key around her neck is no challenge with an elderly person, much less a dementia patient. All that stated sadly, just the reality of it. Keep the locker for candy and other things of no value only. As for the cash, others here have used fake cash that looks very real, I haven’t dealt with this as yet, so I’m not sure where it comes from, but hopefully someone will let us know. You’re very correct to be concerned and know that her having all this cash is a bad plan

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Sometimes you can bring smaller bills, as they really don't grasp the denominations any more. Like bring her $20 in ones, and $20 in 5's and she will think she has a lot of money. Tell her, "You really don't use more than $40 in a week and this will keep "them" from taking it. My inlaws mow through graham crackers and whenever they leave a half eaten package out in the main living area, the custodians will throw it away (it's not marked) They tell us it was "stolen" all the time.

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I really like this idea, and in any case would surely keep her counting.

(5)

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I am worried here. If all her needs are taken care of how can she conceivably be wanting as much as 200.00 a week, and what in the world is there to spend it on. I am very afraid that Mom may be giving money away.
I think your answer that the facility is no longer allowing this amount of cash to be kept is wonderful, and I would engage them in a "therapeutic lie" to tell her this with you. Even a lock box can be carried right out. Clearly something has made this whole cash thing important to her, in her dementia, but it isn't realistic. This is a LOT of money.
You say you are both on Mom's accounts. I hope that you are her POA. It isn't necessarily a good thing to mix and meld the names on Mom's money for record keeping and the future. More qualified than me (Tacy, for instance) could likely explain the reasons why, but I would pass by an attorney how best to handle this.
Good luck.

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I'm not at all sure that any ethicist would support me on this, but can you "recycle" the cash you bring her? So that you duly turn up with (some amount in small bills) as she asks, but you also discreetly remove the same or more from her existing kitty and keep it safe for next time.

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Not a bad idea. However, she's pretty shrewd where money is concerned. I thought about getting some realistic looking play money but worried that she'd actually try spending it. I also thought about marking the bills with a highlighter to maybe deter theft. I may try giving her a lot of ones and maybe a couple fives and tens to make it look like she has more. Not sure whether she'll be fooled, but it's worth a try.

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She is living in the "before care" world, and $200.00 was probably OK with her. At my dad's facility, no money is needed, and he never carries any - they add all charges on to the monthly rent. However, with dementia, my mother, who passed away years ago, just wanted money in her wallet. It really didn't matter the denomination. We made sure she had 2 - $1.00 bills. I don't think she could even count it - it truly didn't matter, but just made her less anxious. (Probably a trait left over from the depression generation.) I think her facility would agree the less money she has the better.

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I one has, for example, ten well-circulated $1 bills, they will look nice and fat inside a wallet. A $5 may give the bearer the impression of considerably more wealth (that is, more than just the extra $5 itself).

However, one must keep in mind that a sum regarded as trivial by one person may be considered significant by another, especially if the latter is a petty thief or a drug addict, so it still should be guarded carefully. (For example, a desperate person may attack or kill someone for that amount, although hopedly this wouldn't be an issue in an AL or NH.)

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In the 2 LTC facilities my MIL was in they had a Resident Trust account for each person. Tell your mom you have set that up for her and if she needs anything she will have the money in that account to pay for it. If her facility doesn't have a resident trust I'd be very surprised.

Learning our LOs' dementia behaviors is a constant creative adjustment, but (respectfully) going forward you and sister will need to scrutinize things your mom asks you to do. Giving her cash in a NH is very ill-advised as sometimes theft is a "crime of opportunity"...too tempting to someone who may not have been planning it. Maybe someone in the NH is telling your mom to ask for the money??

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She actually used another patient's cell phone to call me one day. She has a phone in her room that I pay $25 a month for but, for some strange reason, she wouldn't use it. That patient (also with dementia), told her she owed him $20 for the call. I told her NOT to give him $20 and reported the incident to the facility nurse but I can't say with any certainty that she didn't give it to him.

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I would get crisp brand new $2 bills from the bank and give her 10 of them. The odd denomination will probably make her think that she has a lot of money on her.

I would also have a meeting to find out what exactly could mom be spending money on as everything is billed. Some staff are unscrupulous enough to accept tips on the sly.

My dad did the same thing, wanted a wallet full of cash and couldn't keep track of it, always saying someone stole money. How do you know, you can't keep track of how much you started with. Ugh!

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At this point you are now the parent and she’s the child. This is a hard transition for us as well! Sadly she’s no longer able to manage money and other valuables wisely so you’re forced to have to make the best decisions to keep her safe. Trust me it will only get increasingly worse. I went through the same with my mother as well and it’s so hard getting them to understand why we have to say no. Trust your instincts and don’t loose heart when she lashes out. You’re doing the hard but right thing ❤️

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Talk to Her Doctor, Her dementia has gotten worse, You are in Charge here.

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My mother's memory care recommended that residents have only small amounts of money in their rooms ($5-10). There is always the possibility of her doing something odd with the money, tucking it away somewhere where it could be thrown away, theft, etc. $200 is way too much. Try giving it to her in small bills and change so it looks like more. Don't let it accumulate if she isn't using it.

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I have been getting $100-$200 from the credit union in smaller bills and dolling it out to her in small amounts over a few weeks in an attempt to appease her and limit the amount she is losing. When she lived with me, she used to hide money all over her room - in her bookshelf, under the mattress, in dresser drawers, etc. I haven't yet seen evidence that she's doing this in her room at memory care, but I peek into the foot locker and drawers every so often when I visit to make sure she isn't doing it there.

(3)

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I'm stunned that the facility allows her to have any cash at all. Usually it's $20 at the most.
Take the money back. Give the facility money for her needs.
Ok, about that bank account.
If your name is on it, that means it is joint, unless you are on there as POA only.
Remember that means that from the moment she went into care you needed to start keeping very accurate records. Especially you want to know how much was in there the day she went in, because 1/2 of that money on that day was yours. Now it gets messy because if it was less than 5 yrs before she went into care then all the money was hers and the 1/2 you were "given" by putting you on the account was a "gift" and you will need to be quite careful.
I am a broken record on this but "see a lawyer". Use her money to do it. Prepay her funeral. If she ends up on medicaid it can get quite messy if it's not set up right.
Sorry, not trying to freak you out but it can be an issue with joint accounts.

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Mom went into care 3 years ago. She has the rest of her accounts, investments and property in a trust administered by her CPA that was set up 10+ years ago. Her long term care insurance has been paying for 80% of her care and the trustee has been paying the rest from the trust. I have been paying the bills for her needs, her medical insurance, life insurance, some property expenses (excluding taxes), and medical copays from the account I am on. I do it electronically and everything is noted, which is fortunate since I'm not a great record keeper. Anyone who would need to see it can ask me for a print out and I will get it from the credit union. I'm not hiding anything or using any of her money for my own purposes. In fact, I've moved her money into higher interest bearing accounts than she had it in so that she is making more. The trustee told me I could open CDs in her name but she did not want to do that, so I obeyed her wishes. The trustee also told me that when the long term insurance money runs out, we will need to tap these accounts for her care.

(5)

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I recently had the same thing happen with my Mom. the AL came up with a solution of putting approx $200 in a little lock box that the Director keeps in her desk. Only Mom and I have a key.
i told Mom we are doing this to keep the money safe but still available to her.
the Director knows she only spends small amounts each time, so she monitors what Mom takes out of the box.
i was lucky enough to have this option, maybe her facility director would allow this also?
hope this helps.

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I would get the Netspend credit card. you have a cash app on your phone and you can add money to her card from her bank account. If anyone were to steal it, its only the little you put on it at a time. You also have a record on your phone exactly what its being spent on. Everyone has swipes today.

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My mom is the same with tucking money away and forgetting she did that and thinking it was stolen. Hopefully she has a hiding place you will find and it isn’t taken or lost. Mom gets in the habit of wrapping important things in tissues or paper towels to keep safe and money and things have been thrown away. Anyway an idea might be to give her $10-20 in $1 bills so she has a full wallet. If she still has money in her purse I would try and “replace” with the same so you are not adding until she has none.
Hope this helps.

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Stop bringing her money. Give her a prepaid debit card and only put a very small amount on it - maybe $25. Tell her that her money is on the card and for her to call you about needs for anything. If the card is regularly "getting lost" then give her cards without any money on them.

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If he has dementia she probably will not remember if you've given her money or not. Just give her a couple of dollars at a time. If she needs money for a hairdresser at her facility, ask the hairdresser if you can pay her direct prior to each appointment. One facility where my MIL lived prior to her death kept money for the residents in an account for things like newspapers, hair care, etc. and an accounting was given periodically as to how much was left. It was up to each family how much they put in the account for their loved one.

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The hairdresser sends me a bill every month, which I pay electronically out of mom's account. When she goes out for coffee or lunch in the facility's bus, they pay for whatever she gets, then bills it monthly. They do, however, go to places like the dollar store where she likes to buy things. Occasionally, my sister or niece takes her somewhere to shop - Mom loves thrift shops - and she will give them money for gas or buy their lunch, as well as picking up something for herself. It doesn't happen often but I think having money in her purse is more of a comfort or a habit to her than a necessity.

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I am wondering also what it is your mother is spending money on. Does she give some to other residents? Maybe she's not spending it very fast, as you mention it accumulated to $1000 at one point. Having money available probably gives her some feeling of control, but even $200 is too much cash to have sitting around in a NH. I'm not offering much of an answer. I've never had to deal with this problem. Let us know if you come up with a workable solution!

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Our mother, when still living in her condo, kept a similar amount in her drawer. When I took over her finances, I would replenish it as needed, but it wasn't too often. Most everything she had to pay for outside house bills was paid for on her credit card. She had told/showed me once, long ago, of a stash she kept in case she "had to get outta here", basically some kind of emergency fund. While cleaning out her condo, I did search for that stash, planning to add it to her credit union account, but she must have, at some point, used it up - never found it.

As for giving money OR ANY kind of card (credit or debit, including those debit cards that have to be replenished, aka not linked to a bank account), I would NOT be providing her with cash. I can't even imagine what she would need it for and it will just get lost, misplaced, hidden or stolen. Our mother is in MC, and anything "extra" that comes up (excluding hair cuts, which I have to arrange payment for) will be billed by the facility (generally it is extra cleaning charges for "accidents.") The facility has billed for times they have picked up some OTC meds, but I try to make sure they do not do this - there have been charges they couldn't justify and they took it off the bill.

My recommendation is similar to others - they make "play" money that is very realistic looking. I would give her THAT money and be done with giving her cash. If the facility takes them on outings, they could let you know ahead of time if there is any need for cash, but I don't understand how they would think anyone in MC could "manage" money!

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Is there any way you can 're-give' her money each week: hand her $100 on week one, then before week two, take the $100 out of her purse and 're-give' it to her.

Or, give her a few $5 bills each week and tell her you forgot to stop at the bank. Depending upon where she is in the dementia journey, that can work. It did for my dad. I actually used $1 bills.

Though it is possible her money or possessions have been stolen by staff, it's much more common that the resident themselves misplaced it or gave it to a neighbor or that another resident moved it or took it.

ps - I would stop asking mom if she wants to take your name off of her accounts. Dementia is another word for bad decision making. Also, consult an elder law attorney. You want to make sure you're protected financially and that mom doesn't become ineligible for Medicaid someday if that's a consideration. Co-mingled finances can be tricky.

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My parents are not in skilled nursing but they have 24-hour sitters at a retirement home. The facility has a gift shop and they go to the hairdresser, but they can put those charges on their account. However, there is a farmer's market that only takes cash and occasionally there is an estate sale after someone passes away and they want to buy a book or some small item. We make sure they have $20, and that is it.

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Ask the facility if they have a trust account system where money is deposited in trust for her with the bookkeeper - my mom's place had this & we referred to it as the small on site bank - she would get money out for outings & would deposit what she didn't spend when she came back - she kept change in her purse but no large bills - she liked being able to go to the 'bank' herself -

The tuck shop was there too but as she was diabetic I provided small chocolate bars that they gave & 'charged her account' - she would often buy one for a friend too & they would have great fun with their treats

As mom got further it was just having something in her purse not the amount - much like a young child would rather have 4 nickels than a quarter because then it was 4 monies not 1 so she may get to where 3 $5s are more important than a $20

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The MC community where I work asks the POA whether the resident is allowed to have cash, and most are NOT. There is no need for cash in such an environment, and I would tell your mother it's no longer permitted. My own mother lives in MC and she has $20 to her name at any given time, never more. It's never a good idea to have large sums of cash in such an environment for a myriad of reasons. Let common sense prevail, and your mom will eventually come around.

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Before bringing her any additional cash, check to see what she has to avoid the large savings amount your sister found. You can always blame it on the facility when talking to her -- they only allow you to have XX dollars in your purse. Perhaps try that with her

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I went through something like this with mom. When she asked me for more money, we would count how much she had and then "top it off." Having her count the money was also a way to assess her functional memory. There were occasions in which she misplaced cash, but mostly it worked. I also kept emergency cash in a unmistakably identifiable wallet hidden away. If something prevented me from being able to bank for her, I could direct her to the wallet so that she didn't run out. Never had to use it, by the way. Luckily, all of her home health aides were dependable and honest. My grandmother had more severe dementia and at one point had to move into long term care. When we were cleaning out her house, we discovered money tuck at regular intervals under the the whole length of the carpet runner in her hall, and paper money wrapped in kleenex (appearing like trash) by her bedside. Sometimes, paranoia occurs with dementia, so she may be hiding her money. Look under the mattress, chair cushions, and similar spots. Oh dear. It is so hard to find that balance between dignified independence and necessary assistance.

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When my dad entered MC he no longer had any notion of what "cash" was, I don't think. We always made sure he had some when he moved in with us..because when we took him out he always offered to pay.. so we let him "chip in" and he felt good! But both of them.. loved to have cash around. When I had to move them here I found ALOT of cash hidden around the house.. I told my friend who came to help me move dad that if I crashed the truck,, she should grab the bag first!! Mom is still with us, lives with us. She takes 900 out every month,, no matter what.. and adds some to her casino money ( we go about every 3 months) and pays the cleaning gal.. the rest mostly accumulates. Every few months she has hubs count her cash, and he puts the cash in our gun safe. She wont put it back in the bank.. just likes knowing its "available" Maybe a depression era thing.. never want to run out?

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She probably figures that what the bank pays these days is hardly worth having it there.

(1)

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$1,000.00 cash is too much to have on her person. This could be earning interest or invested. Don't give her any more.

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If you mean my mom,, it's not on her person,, its in her desk in our living room or our safe..LOL And she never goes anywhere without us.. I think it is a leftover from when she and dad lived at their house. She gives me some if I order her something from my CC, etc. It makes her feel to good to "contribute" as she only pays 2 small bills here. And if I go pick up some of her meds or small groceries. We have tried to get her to put some back in the bank,, no go .

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Some people get like that. I have actually brought the denominations down. Example: She was getting $100 in twenty's, now I will give her or swap $20 *3, $10*4. So when she asks just keep making change. They will forget. Just as long as they see a lot, they will be OK. Now, if they are still with it, then make it important that you and her get together on why she needs a certain amount. Example: OK Mom I'll be there later to go over expenses with you. Then OK, you're going to get your hair done, nails and lunch this week here is your $100 and this includes tip. I'll be by next week to what you want to do. They don't want to feel like a dependent. This way they feel independent. It's a team effort.

SC

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Dear Lord, I can identify with you except my Mom
did not have memory problems! She was just mean
as hell! A good Mom (single) but always, poor me!
My sister never spent a dime coming home to help
but she was the favorite. Wish I could have & should
have just walked away!!

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UPDATE: I had put $50 in Mom's wallet, put it in her purse and put the purse in her footlocker and locked it. A week later, Mom told me her footlocker had been broken and the money taken. I went to check it out and, sure enough, someone had first tried to cut into the plastic footlocker next to the lock, then they grabbed and twisted the lock and broke or cut the piece that holds the lock. The locker is heavy duty plastic so It took strength and some kind of sharp object - neither available to the residents - so it would have to be an employee. I reported it to the director, who dismissed it, telling me they would replace the footlocker if the maintenance man (who is very kind to Mom) couldn't fix it. Didn't seem to concern her at all that there is quite possibly a thief among her employees.

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Stop bringing your mom money.

Doesn't the facility have an account system where residents have their money held for them for outings and such?

If mom gets angry, blame the director. "The director said you cant keep money in your room". If course, arrange this with the director first.

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How do I handle Mom's requests for more money?

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