My question is about tithing. Dementia mom with very limited funds requires 24/7 AL care. She wants to make sure her tithe is paid from SS.

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My question is about tithing. Dementia mom with very limited funds requires 24/7 AL care. She wants to make sure her tithe is paid from SS.

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My 84 y/o mom is frantic over me handling her finances because I have not tithed to her old church off of her social security. Her finances are very tricky as it is. We are Christians and tithe ourselves but are struggling with this. Any opinions?

Assisted Living Financial Planning Paying for Care

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I think the key difficulty here is getting your mom to understand and accept that she is unable to give 10% of her “income”. I don’t think she will be open to change her mindset at this point, hence I believe it becomes a matter of how YOU handle it.

If she never looks at her statements and you have full control of her finances then just do what is right. I’d either give what is possible to church, whatever that looks like, or increase your own contribution, and tell your mom she is contributing. It is not lying because you are in fact contributing.

The key is not to get her upset and confused. God would never want to see her or anybody else feeling guilty and upset because they couldn’t tithe. Actually to me when we talk about the widow that gave a little but it was really all she had, what I think about is not money. In life there are so many opportunities to give our all, to serve, to care, to love! That doesn’t require any income.

In summary I would just help her be at peace. She doesn’t need to know any details of how or how much you’are contributing nor she needs to understand tithing pertains to the old covenant versus the new covenant, all of that is good information and conversation, but I’m afraid not for her. She will not feel at peace just with that, opposite to that, she may believe you’re refusing to contribute and that may create bigger problems.

Do what is right and save her worries. As long as you know and feel in your heart that you are doing what is correct then all is fine, specially in God’s eyes. I’m sure He will greatly appreciate it if in compensation you give more of yourself to others, for her, which I think is the currency we human beings really struggle with the most, therefore the most needed contribution!

May God bless you and good luck!

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My personal opinion is if that is your mom’s desire to please God, I would try to honor it. But make sure her old church is preaching & living the true gospel. If not, see if you can give her tithe to a reputable church or ministry that is doing the Lord’s work. God bless.

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Tithing depends on the particular church. In some cases, members of a church (that doesn't include non members/random visitors) are expected to give a percentage of their wages.

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About tithing - I know it is not in the New Testament. We should do what we can to help others as Christ commanded, but this is not a set amount, just what you reasonably can in your circumstances. Also, let's keep in mind that the Old Testament was before current day paying of taxes that supported public welfare benefits - so if you paid your taxes that would have to be counted, at least to some extent, as against any tithe obligation.

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Introduce her to George W. Greene - he's probably the best at explaining that tithing is not required in the NT. We are to give with a cheerful heart, not under compulsion. There are many other pastors and preachers that understand this. The tithe was for the OT. It should also be noted that only those that made a living off the land were required to tithe, and there were at least 3, if not 4 tithes - but irrelevant because it's not required in the NT. It should also be noted that the poor did not tithe, but were beneficiaries of the poor tithe. So many people have been deceived into believing the tithe lie. The poor widow was not an example of how to give either. She was Jesus' example of how widows were being "devoured". Again, I defer to George W. Greene - "In your Bible" videos.

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I don't think any tithing is considered "deceitful". Tithing gives us a tangible way to express our thanks and gratitude to God. I would encourage you to seek more than one source to justify non-tithing.

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I didn't mean to hijack your thread, i saw multiple responses about not knowing if this was still tax deductible, i just did a continuing ed seminar on the 2018 tax changes so i thought i would clear it up for those questioning.

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All good, my friend! ((Hugs))

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My OP was really not so much about income tax deduction, but appreciate everyone’s input.

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I see a question about church donations being deductible or not, yes they are, the amount has increased from 50% to 60% of AGI. Hope that helps.

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That's true, but for income tax filing year 2018, the Standard Deduction has increased; thus some people may opt to take the Standard Deduction if their Itemized Deduction is lower.

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As a Christian, I find these comments curious.
Yes, the tithe (10%) was instituted in the OT, along with other restrictions, like dietary laws that were kinda rescinded in the NT. However, it's not mentioned one way or the other in the NT; and the tithe of one's income--not of whatever one has left after other expenses--is still the rule in most Christian communities, whether observed or not.

Jesus taught us to pay our taxes--"render to Ceaser that which is Ceaser's"--and after that, ALL we have belongs to God. Not 10%, but 100%. Not just money, but life itself. We are merely put in charge of properly managing God's resources that have been entrusted to us, preferably in a way that glorifies God.

In this lady's case, thoughtful determination of how her meager income should be used to glorify God might mean using it all for her necessary personal care.

IMO, a church that doesn't even provide her with spiritual support during this time is probably not where her money will be best used to glorify God anyway.

In my own experience, I saw to it that my loved ones' regular church donations were presented to the pastor when she visited. When she visited after 6 weeks, I wrote a check for 6x their customary weekly amount, etc. No visits, no $. I also saw to it that 10% of their final estate went to their church, as was their desire.
However, my LO could well afford to do this without financial strain or reliance on others for financial support.

Furthermore, tithing is not a requirement to avoid hellfire. It's meant to be a minimum and grateful response to a loving Provider.

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Her pastor has not been to see her. Not once. Thank you for your insight and wisdom.

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AT1234: Okay. Maybe I didn't see all of your posts, but you did say "I am not using her money. I am paying her bills." Her SS income is just that-her money. As far as income tax filing year 2018, some Itemized Deductions have changed. As I said in another post, tithes to churches may or may not be deductible. I don't know. I do know that many individuals will opt for the Standard Deduction since in a lot of cases that will be a higher $ amount than one's Itemized Deductions. To meet the Itemized Deduction for MEDICAL, a filer must have 10% of AGI of medical expenses.

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Correct. Her money is just that, her money and yes she takes standard deduction.

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I understand ! My grandmother turned 100 years old on 5/2018 she passed 8/2018, my cousin cared for her and was over all her affairs, and tithing to her church of 70 years was an absolute must, she also lived merely on a small SSI benefit .
But this was what she wanted, too give back. As Christian we are taught to tithe 10% of our first fruits and we will be blessed . We as a family had no problem with her wanting to tithe, Her pastor and members were very good to her, unable to attend service her pastor and few members would come to the house with key board in hand and have Sunday service and give her communion. Her Church I would pray is doing the same. Either way if she wants to tithe do it! just pick-up the slack . You'll be blessed.

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No, her church isn’t doing the same. Pick up the slack? What does that even mean?

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Sendhelp: As far as income tax reporting, tax laws have some changes, e. g. Itemized Deductions in particular may no longer allow a church tithe deduction. I don't know, but I do know that there have been some changes, especially to what a person can deduct and in many cases, a person MAY be so inclined to take the Standard Deduction in 2018 tax filing year because it will be a higher $ amount.

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AT1234: Why are you "not using her money? and paying her bills?"

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I am paying her bills with her SS. The implication was “since I’m using her money” that my interests would be served rather than hers.
on income tax: charitable gifts of 10% don’t qualify (at least alone) to itemize so standard deduction esp in coming years apparently

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Honor her request. Pay your mom’s tithe!

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If your mom wants to tithe and you are using her money I believe that you should tithe for her. Read Malachi. The Lord will watch out for her.

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I am not using her money. I am paying her bills.

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If there is no money to tithe, then. so be it.

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This is something we have been wondering about also. I totally appreciate a forum where we can ask these questions and get honest, Biblically-based answers. My concerns have now been put to rest on this, as I hope yours have also.

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Tithing is taken from "excess" in most Christian religions, only a few require it from "first fruits". Perhaps have a discussion with her pastor and have him/her talk to your mom. As you indicate, there is little to nothing left to tithe. Surely the pastor can tell her that God understands that she needs every penny.

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Tithing is an old testament teaching, never mentioned by Paul in any of his instructions to us today. (Tithing is not for today). If it were for us today, you would find it in the Pauline epistles, which are specific to our Grace dispensation. Today we are instructed to be "cheerful givers", & to support the preaching of the "death burial resurrection" Gospel, (that we are saved only by the Blood of Christ the Lord at the Cross.) Blessings.✌

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remind them of the widow’s mite

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FairieFiles described exactly how we handle tithe and offering with my 95-year old father. He was ordained a minister 75 years ago and has tithed every cent and given many other offerings over and above his tithe. He even insisted that the significant amount of money my mother's sister bequeathed to her be tithed. Shortly after Mom died in 2011, my brother (DPOA) and I were able to help him see that all his income from SocSec & retirement had already been tithed. Now I write him a $50 monthly check for his offering. He is happy with that. Once a year or so, he will need to hear the rationale again, and once it's explained, he's fine again. Any monetary gifts he receives from friends or family can be tithed if he wishes.

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FairieFiles described exactly how we handle tithe and offering with my 95-year old father. He was ordained a minister 75 years ago and has tithed every cent and given many other offerings over and above his tithe. He even insisted that the significant amount of money my mother's sister bequeathed to her be tithed. Shortly after Mom died in 2011, my brother (DPOA) and I were able to help him see that all his income from SocSec & retirement had already been tithed. Now I write him a $50 monthly check for his offering. He is happy with that. Once a year or so, he will need to hear the rationale again, and once it's explained, he's fine again. Any monetary gifts he receives from friends or family can be tithed if he wishes.

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Easiest answer........give what is affordable. The Old Testament is 1 thing, but the New Testament does not (as I remember) state that 1 must give 10%. The Old Testament, yes. We live in current days and God understands that one can only give that of which they are able. If we follow the teachings of the Old Testament, there would not be divorce, you'd have sister wives, wait hand/foot on your husband as well as being told what to do every minute of your life. He could kick you out as an accepted form of divorce, beat you if he's upset. You would need a large fire pit to burn a sacrifice at the Sabbath. How about that Burka outfit?!
If you only have $2 and need $1.50 to care for yourself/family, God will accept the .50 as your sacrifice.

God also allows you to stretch the truth now with Mom.

Don't let Mom place that guilt on you. He knows what you NEED to take care of your Mom.

Being a Christian means you BELIEVE. You're not TIED by the constraints of someone standing at a pulpit TELLING YOU what you must do or can't do.

If it were not for people like Martin Luther, Lutherns would not exist. Henry VIII booted the Pope out and the Church of England was born.

If it weren't for Jesus' resurrection and the Apostles in the upper room, I would not have been raised Pentecostal.

Were it not for God having a conversation with Abraham, my husband wouldn't be Jewish.

God, the Son, Holy Ghost (if you believe in 3 separate entities) really just expect BELIEF, LOVE and what you can do for your beliefs.

Your true belief is between you and God. My step-father is very religious and believes that one must commune with others to have a true conversation with God.
I asked him, if 1 cannot even though he believes, have a conversation with God should he be by himself, how was Jesus able to talk with God AND Devil in the desert? What about people who cannot get to church because they're all alone? How many times did you pray when you had a pop quiz in school? How can people be expected to tithe when they have nothing to even be able to care for themselves?
FAITH is believing in something one cannot see. I think that comes from ACTS. It doesn't say FAITH is something you buy by tithing.

GOD UNDERSTANDS and knows what is in your heart and your Mother's. He expects you to take care of your Mother.

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Amen! Its so funny how tithing is the only thing that was brought to churches from the old testament. We were raised as christians and were taught tithing comes from your heart! Not your pocket book. As my mother use to say God doesnt need money and he always provides. So sad because my MIL gives hundreds a month to charity and my husband and I are paying the doctor bills. We just tell her now that we sent the checks. God knows are hearts and this is not a requirement to get to heaven. Done with my ranting!

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10% of nothing = nothing - it is more important to pay her bills - maybe send $1.00 a month for her tithing

Tithing by a church to someone who hasn't enough money to pay for the essentials is WRONG - will someone come & talk to her about it? - but stay with them so they don't walk away with a big cheque - I'd make them swear to help or don't arrange it

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I would not tithe! I don't believe in that. The church has plenty of money plus they are a 501C corp and pay no taxes. If you're struggling, why give the money to someone else. Doesn't hold water.

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I was given the same information as KBEllison. My late mother had always given to her church and wanted to continue. I was advised to keep the donations at about the same percentage of her income and keep records. If Medicaid was needed later, there would not be a penalty. I was told that this was also the case for cash birthday gifts for children, grandchildren and great grandchildren as long as they could be shown to be a long-standing practice and the amounts were not increased. My mother did not outlive her assets, so I never had to put this to the test, but it was comforting to know that I wouldn’t have to come up with thousands of dollars to make up for five years of church donations if Medicaid had been needed.

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Follow her wishes and continue to tithe. Sometimes in our worries, God is last on our minds but when we include Him, He will take care of us.

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I'm in the same place as AT1234,, there will be no tithing above $1.00., She cannot live on SS. and I am caring for her for free. She can't live without food, and shelter.,, The church is not taking care of her (us). I hope when it's your turn, you have an easier time of it.

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Just went through the same thing with my parents. Our Elder-Attorney (in Connecticut) told them they can continue as long as the tithing has been customary and consistent with their past giving, it won't be a problem when they go to apply for Title IXX (Medicaid). I made sure that made it into our notes for later reference just in case ... That's what he said!

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It’s important to her- so do it. Be obedient and leave the consequences to God.

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Lot's of good approaches here and while I would start with some of the justifications for your mom no longer needing or being expected to tithe (her income is no longer "earned" and technically she has already tithed on that income back when someone was working and tithing on that earned income before what she is living on now was put away. OK perhaps overly simplified but...or any of the other points made below about the difference in her situation now, I can imagine that she may not be able to retrain her understanding and simple life pattern on tithing. You know your mom best and how and when to approach some of these thought or not. We all have probably experienced the inability of or elder LO's to change a life pattern and this may be like that for your mom, in which case I would take the difference in amount to tithe on approach and find a way to tithe a little something simply for her piece of mind, it doesn't sound like she is on Medicaid just yet but maybe even using their formula of $50-$100 a month being "her's" to spend so that's what she can and should be tithing, it is her spending money and I don't think it's against Medicare rules if or when she is on Medicare so things wouldn't change either. I sure hope a clergy member (preferably from the church she has supported all these years) from somewhere, maybe even your church or the NH, wherever her services will be held when she passes, some clergy member should be visiting and supporting her given how devout she has been all her life, would be happy to help by talking to her about it, releasing her of the expectation to tithe and explain that she should now let the younger parishioners support her the way she has those that came ahead of her all these years. I'm not presenting that well but if it's hard to find a member of the clergy, from the denomination she belongs too, who is willing and able to help you and your mom through this something is very wrong.

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My question is about tithing. Dementia mom with very limited funds requires 24/7 AL care. She wants to make sure her tithe is paid from SS.

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